Injured pigeon not eating

Dear NiteOwl, Teresa and Cindy,

Thank you very much for you good wishes. I was able to contact my two other friends, too. They are OK except that the family of one of them lost their house which they were also using as a store. It is very sad, of course but at least they are all safe.


And something about Kader:

Dear Teresa,

I put drapes on Kader's cage as you showed me with the pictures of Piper's cage. I was thinking that she would like some privacy but she became very irritated with them. She tried to escape the cage. I closed the cage door and waited for her to calm down but she didn't. At the end I had to remove them.

Before Kader had her cage and was living between the bathroom and the kitchen, we used the method of throwing a large piece of cloth on her to catch her. But soon we realized that she was simply too afraid of that. She started to panic when she saw us walking with things like newspapers, towels, etc ... So we stopped doing it altogether. Although it has been a long time that we didn't use this method, I am guessing that the drapes remind her of being caught and this is why she reacted so strongly. It is too bad that we scared her so much.

Best Wishes.

Ghanima, I'll bet you're right. She probably remembers you catching her that way. Sorry it didn't work. Maybe if you put the curtain on just one side for a while. Then later you could add another piece, after she gets used to it and realizes that it isn't going to catch her. It may work, or may not. Good try anyway.

Dear NiteOwl,

NiteOwl wrote:

Ghanima, I'll bet you're right. She probably remembers you catching her that way. Sorry it didn't work. Maybe if you put the curtain on just one side for a while. Then later you could add another piece, after she gets used to it and realizes that it isn't going to catch her. It may work, or may not. Good try anyway.

Yes, I that what I did already. I mean I already put the curtain on part of the cage in such a way that it covered only about 1/4 of it. But even that was enough to scare her. Maybe it is best to wait a few weeks more and try again. She seems happy enough without it, anyway.

Regards.

I see. Probably a good idea to wait then. She may never want the curtain. Most do like it.

Oh dear! You must be right, she must be associating the curtain with being caught, especially if the colour is not very different. It's amazing the associations they make!
Best leave it out then, so as not to frighten her.

I'm so glad to hear your friends are safe!

Hi Ghanima,
I'm so glad your friends are OK.

Just curious, did you try putting the drape on Kader's cage while she was out of the cage?

Ghanima...I'm so glad your friends are ok.
My friend, visiting from Boston and I watched in horror, last Friday evening has live shots of the tsunami were shown on the television. I stayed with the coverage until the wee hours, too sick to sleep.
My heart aches for the families and friends of all the souls that left us on that day.

I don't cover adult pigeons that have not been accustomed to being covered. I have found that it does freak them out especially if the entire cage is covered. The exception is adult couples that are making a nest together and seem to want a bit of seclusion. Even then, I only cover three sides, leaving the front open or I'll cover the nest area. I would think that with your girl she might like to be able to see what is going on so that she feels a part of your life.
I think the baskets can work just fine for a nest. Many members use them. Recently, I bought some baskets to put in a a book case converted to nest sites. I had some heavy card board boxes, which I love and the birds love too but I was two short. The baskets are a perfect size and depth but when the pigeons step on the rim, they tip over and that could be deadly and so I removed them.
I also have some little wooden boxes that are heavy and make a great nest box.
I also pad the nest box with some soft towel and then let the birds add twigs and such.

Dear AZWhitefeather,

I am sorry for my delayed reply.

AZWhitefeather wrote:

Hi Ghanima,
I'm so glad your friends are OK.

Just curious, did you try putting the drape on Kader's cage while she was out of the cage?

At first I tried when Kader is inside the cage. She get very nervous as I described above. This was probably a silly thing to do.

But after you asked I decided to try the other way around before answering you. Today I took Kader out, put the curtain to cover about 1/4 of the cage and put Kader back in. Although not as much as the first time, she was definitely nervous this time, too. So I removed the curtain. This curtain is a different color than the piece of cloth that we used to catch her but I think she has a very strong association in her mind. So for the time being, I think waiting is the best thing to do.

Cheers.

Dear Mathilda,

Matilda wrote:

Ghanima...I'm so glad your friends are ok.
My friend, visiting from Boston and I watched in horror, last Friday evening has live shots of the tsunami were shown on the television. I stayed with the coverage until the wee hours, too sick to sleep.
My heart aches for the families and friends of all the souls that left us on that day.

I am very sorry about what happened, too. But at least I have one good news: My friend's father in law has been found in a shelter area yesterday. Poor old man had a difficult time but he is OK now.

Matilda wrote:

I don't cover adult pigeons that have not been accustomed to being covered. I have found that it does freak them out especially if the entire cage is covered. The exception is adult couples that are making a nest together and seem to want a bit of seclusion. Even then, I only cover three sides, leaving the front open or I'll cover the nest area. I would think that with your girl she might like to be able to see what is going on so that she feels a part of your life.

Thank you very much for the information. You are right in that Kader likes to watch us. She is not afraid of us even when we are sitting just next to her cage and talking. I think she has the realization that the cage is her home and she is safe there.

Matilda wrote:

The baskets are a perfect size and depth but when the pigeons step on the rim, they tip over and that could be deadly and so I removed them. I also have some little wooden boxes that are heavy and make a great nest box.

I understand what you mean and keep that in mind.

Many thanks for your post and best wishes.

Ghanima wrote:

I am very sorry about what happened, too. But at least I have one good news: My friend's father in law has been found in a shelter area yesterday. Poor old man had a difficult time but he is OK now.

Wonderful news!

Matilda wrote:

Ghanima...I'm so glad your friends are ok.
My friend, visiting from Boston and I watched in horror, last Friday evening has live shots of the tsunami were shown on the television. I stayed with the coverage until the wee hours, too sick to sleep.
My heart aches for the families and friends of all the souls that left us on that day.

I don't cover adult pigeons that have not been accustomed to being covered. I have found that it does freak them out especially if the entire cage is covered. The exception is adult couples that are making a nest together and seem to want a bit of seclusion. Even then, I only cover three sides, leaving the front open or I'll cover the nest area. I would think that with your girl she might like to be able to see what is going on so that she feels a part of your life.
I think the baskets can work just fine for a nest. Many members use them. Recently, I bought some baskets to put in a a book case converted to nest sites. I had some heavy card board boxes, which I love and the birds love too but I was two short. The baskets are a perfect size and depth but when the pigeons step on the rim, they tip over and that could be deadly and so I removed them.I also have some little wooden boxes that are heavy and make a great nest box.
I also pad the nest box with some soft towel and then let the birds add twigs and such.

I see what you mean, it's always the problem with 'nests' that are quite light. I have tried a number of ideas, like tying one side of the basket or cardboard box to the cage bars (maybe, for a set-up like your converted bookcase, to a small curtain hook screwed to the wooden side?), or else using flat stones, a piece of slate or similar, wrapped in cardboard for insulation, to weigh the bottom of the basket down.

Ghanima wrote:

I have one good news: My friend's father in law has been found in a shelter area yesterday. Poor old man had a difficult time but he is OK now.

That's great news, Ghanima. What a relief.
Bless his heart.

Hi Ghanima!

How's Kader doing? Would love an update!

Dear Teresa,

It is good to hear from you. I was traveling again and just got back home a few hours ago.

Kader is doing very well. She is still very thin which is the only thing that worries me. If I have time I can take her to nursery tomorrow and tell you how much she weights.

Although quite thin, she is very active and alert. We let her to balcony during daytime where she moves around and interacts with other pigeons. It is the mating season and our little lady seems to have many admirers. At first we were somewhat worried because it would be very difficult for us if she decides to have kids. For some time my husband vigilantly chased away the spirited young boys from the balcony. But eventually we realized that she has no interest in mating at all. At least not for the time being.

Also, we finally found a nest that she likes. I'll send photos later.

Best Wishes.

Hi Ghanima,
I'm so glad to hear Kader is doing good. And that you and your husband are as well.

Is Kader doing OK eating on her own?
We'd love to see her new nest.

Hi Ghanima,

Great to hear from you, and I hope you had a good trip.

Thanks for the update, I'm really curious to know more about the nest that won Kader's approval. It seems to me you're raising a little princess!

The fact she shows no interest in mating yet is one less headache. But if it did happen, it would be almost impossible for her to sit on the eggs on her own; also, having one pigeon in the house is one thing, having three quite another! It wouldn't be a bad idea to start planning ahead and try to buy two fake eggs, made of plastic or wood. Petra (Pigeonwriter) made plaster eggs for hers, but that's beyond my skill!
Something else to consider is that when pigeons pair up, generally the female will move into the male's territory, so you need to be on your guard in case she tries to escape. My Piper did that once, and for two days I was crazy with worry until I found her. She can't fly more than 3 or 4 metres, and would not have survived out there.

I'll be looking forward to the ...

Dear AZWhitefeather and Teresa,

Here is the photo of the nest.



I found this nest completely by chance in a store in Istanbul. Stuffed with an old piece of cloth, it finally won the little lady's approval.

AZWhitefeather wrote:

Is Kader doing OK eating on her own?

Yes, she is eating on her own. She eats usually two or three times a day but she never eats much. When I watch the other pigeons eating I get the impression that they can eat my whole kitchen if they could put their beaks on it. But Kader is always halfhearted in eating.

I weighed her today. She is 272 grams. She was 266 grams when we first found her and 245 grams through the worst part of her illness. So, apparently she gained a bit of fat but she still looks too thin in comparison to other wild pigeons for which, supposedly, food is in shorter supply!

Teresa wrote:

The fact she shows no interest in mating yet is one less headache.

Well, it looks like I talked a bit too early. Today she did show interest in mating. Actually, I had to run with a soaped dish in my hand to chase the male because she was just about the mate! In the light of this new event, I think I should get a pair of fake eggs as soon as I can. If I put them in her nest she won't mate, is this the idea?

Best Wishes.

The fact that she is light, could she possibly have worms? Maybe putting her outside with the other birds isn't such a great idea. Maybe you should rethink that. If she does choose a mate, and can't be with him, it would only make them both very unhappy. He could go on to choose another mate, but she couldn't do that. If she were mine, I would keep her inside, or find her a disabled mate. That would be great for both of them.

If she does choose a mate out there, that will start the egg laying process anyway.

What a beautiful basket, Ghanima.
Once you get it filled with nesting material I bet Kader will look like a little princess in it.

Jay presents some good 'thoughts to ponder'.

The basket is gorgeous! No wonder she likes it.

The fake eggs won't stop her mating, the idea was to replace any eggs she might lay the moment the second one is laid, i.e. before the embryos start developing, so you don't end up with a house full of pigeons.

Has Kader been wormed? Jay has a very good point there.
My indoor pigeons eat less than the ferals too. I think it's because they do less exercise and they are pickier with their food.

Teresa wrote:

The basket is gorgeous! No wonder she likes it.

The fake eggs won't stop her mating, the idea was to replace any eggs she might lay the moment the second one is laid, i.e. before the embryos start developing, so you don't end up with a house full of pigeons.

Has Kader been wormed? Jay has a very good point there.
My indoor pigeons eat less than the ferals too. I think it's because they do less exercise and they are pickier with their food.

So do mine, for the most part. They're spoiled, and know it will always be there, and they don't have to rush to eat a lot before a predator comes along.

Dear All,

Thank you for your posts and apologies for my delayed answer.

NiteOwl wrote:

The fact that she is light, could she possibly have worms?

Well, the last time I took her to vet, she was checked for worms. She didn't have any at that time. As far as I can tell, she is light because she doesn't eat as much as the other pigeons. I don't know the reason but maybe it is just her nature. Because she was already thin when I first notice her (way before her attack took place). But I would love to do something to make her eat more.

NiteOwl wrote:

Maybe putting her outside with the other birds isn't such a great idea. Maybe you should rethink that. If she does choose a mate, and can't be with him, it would only make them both very unhappy.

You are probably right in making this point. However, she is always very eager to get out during daytime. If we don't let her outside for some reason (like rain or storm) she becomes restless and we have to close the door of her cage. Because otherwise she gets out of the cage and heads straight to the balcony exit and keeps bumping to the glass door if it is closed. I think she really likes to be outside with the other pigeons. However, when it gets dark, she comes back to the balcony door and waits for us to open it so that she can return to her cage. Pigeons are really amazing birds!

So, for the time being we are letting her out but we also keep a watchful eye for her admirers. I understand that she will be unhappy if she chooses a mate and unable to go with him. But she will also be unhappy if we don't let her out. It is a difficult decision.

Cheers.

The vet not finding worms doesn't mean that she does not have them. They just don't show up on every poop sample. Kind of hit or miss thing. I'd be very careful in letting her outside with the others, as an aggressive male could injure her. And if she does regain enough flight to be able to take off, believe me, if she sees a male that she is interested in, she will try to leave with him. That is very important to them. They are programmed to mate and raise babies. That's why I keep Scooter, my handicapped pigeon in the house. Why introduce her to the others only to have her pick a mate that she can't be with. I think that would be meaner than not having her with them at all.

Dear NiteOwl,

NiteOwl wrote:

I'd be very careful in letting her outside with the others, as an aggressive male could injure her.

This is true. In fact, I believe it was another pigeon that injured her to begin with. Before her injury Kader had only a partial ability for flight and always hanged around our balcony. She was sleeping among some old furniture which occupied one end of the balcony. I used to put food in the balcony for all pigeons but especially for Kader. As a result, our balcony was very crowded most of the time. But now I never put food on the balcony and the other pigeons come only occasionally. I do this intensionally so that Kader can be safer when she is out. I think she can still be attacked by another pigeon but the risk is reduced.

As for her regaining the ability to fly, I am ever watchful for this. So far, she is not able to fly for more than about half a meter. Also, when she tries to fly she spins around herself and becomes disoriented. If her flight begins to improve, I think I will have to think seriously because I don't think she can survive out there for her own.

NiteOwl wrote:

Why introduce her to the others only to have her pick a mate that she can't be with. I think that would be meaner than not having her with them at all.

I can't be so sure about it. Maybe my thinking is too much "the human way" but I think I would still want to go out, socialize and meet men even if I couldn't be with the one I love. It also feels to bad to feel lonely, don't you think? Who want's to be in home in a beautiful spring day when the sun is shining outside and you friends are out enjoying the weather?

Thank you for writing your thoughts to me, NiteOwl. I appreciate your opinion and it gives me an opportunity to think aloud.

Cheers.

Just a warning about hawks also. They are very fast, and have swooped down and grabbed pet pigeons off of peoples shoulders. They can be very bold. There is no way you can protect her if one decides to swoop down suddenly, which they do.

I understand what you mean about her having friends and socializing with the others. I really do. I agree that if possible a bird should have their own kind around. I do have disabled birds in my loft that do very nicely with a few little things added to make it easier for them. But they are allowed to mate up and have a pigeons life somewhat. But Kader is vulnerable as she can't fly, and could possibly fall off the balcony, or be injured by an aggressive bird, as she would have a hard time getting away. I do know how you feel about her having a life, but unfortunately, sometimes it's a trade off. To let her have a life, and to keep her safe, there are some things she will have to give up. By keeping her in and letting her fly inside, and interacting with her, you and your husband become her flock. Scooter is happier spending time with us than if I put her in the loft to watch the others. She could be put outside in a cage for sun for a while during the nice weather, where she could still see the other birds, with part of her cage shielded against the sun so she could move in and out of the sun at will. This way you would be keeping her safe. There are lots of people who have disabled birds, and they are very happy just having the people for their flock. Look at the people who own parrots and the like. Same thing.

Another thought would be to find another disabled bird and introducing them. That works well too. You may want to consider this as an option. That way she would have the best of both worlds.