looking for answers?

Hello All, i know its been along time since my last post, but everything was going great for the last 6 months. I had built a new coop in addition to my first. I had one baby grow up in the small coop with its parents and now all three come and go as they wish each day. In the new coop i had 16 new ferals over the last 6 months, Two matched off and laid two eggs but nothing, Than in june two more eggs and one live squeeker one baby died the first day. After 3 weeks all seemed well, they were in a seperate coop and had plenty of food and wated. I came out on Saturday am and the female was dead, removed her right away and hoped the male could feed the baby alone, Came out the next day and both the male and the baby had died. A very sad sight, he had his left wing over the baby. I have no idea what could have caused their passing. All the other birds are fine. It has been hot here (Las Vegas) but they have weathered the last 3 months in 100+ weather. Has this ever happened to anyone out there, There poop always looked ok, I just dont have a clue. Regards Graywolf

That's terrible, heart wrenching news. So many things could have caused their death but I have a feeling it may have been partially related to the heat.
Louise doesn't live far form you and she has been finding many pigeons with severe canker.
Most pigeons have the parasite in their system that causes canker and it's brought out during times of stress. The extreme heat can sure bring on an outbreak.

How did the poop look? Did you notice any bad odor from the pigeons or their poop?

Hi Charis Thanks for the quick reply. The poop was solid and did not smell unusual. The cage did not have any odor to it nor did the birds. There crops were full when i removed them from the cage. I have had a problem with grasshoppers during the hot weather and i know they go into the cages at night for food. I cleaned out both cages very well with mild bleach and dishwashing liquid soap. Washed off all the feed and wated bowls than cleaned all around the coops. Ther weather has cooled off this week ( 90-99) But it will still be hot next week. I will try to post some pics of the coops but the large one is wire cloth on all sides with shelves and bricks to perch on. The two coops are covered on all sides and the top with reflective tarps with lots of air circulating around the coops. Lots of wind here even with the heat. Does canker kill that quickly? It was almost as if they were poisoned they all died so quickly yet all the others are fine. PS I also have a flock of up to 40 other ferals that hang out on the top of the coops and below waiting for seed to fall thru. During the heat of the day i can find 20 or so sleeping with their eyes closed on the coop and on the ground. I put a very large dish of water out for them and the left over seed from the coop feeding dishes. With Regards Graywolf

Hi Graywolf,
First and foremost, I extend my sincere condolences on the loss of your birds.

It sound to me like one or both parents might have had something, passing it along to the babies, given one of the babies died a day after hatching and now the second baby and both parents have passed away.
Without a necropsy, it would be impossible to determine exactly what caused the deaths.

I don't recall if you're familiar with Dr. Hauck so I'm going to post his information in the event you need a vet's assistance in the future.

Dr. Patrick Hauck
2675 E. Flamingo Rd.
Las Vegas, NV 89121
(702) 734-9761
They see both pet and feral pigeons.
If they are feral, the rescuer will need to continue home care as the office will not keep them.
This is a very friendly and supportive office.

hk22045 wrote:

Hi Charis Thanks for the quick reply. The poop was solid and did not smell unusual. The cage did not have any odor to it nor did the birds. There crops were full when i removed them from the cage. I have had a problem with grasshoppers during the hot weather and i know they go into the cages at night for food. I cleaned out both cages very well with mild bleach and dishwashing liquid soap. Washed off all the feed and wated bowls than cleaned all around the coops. Ther weather has cooled off this week ( 90-99) But it will still be hot next week. I will try to post some pics of the coops but the large one is wire cloth on all sides with shelves and bricks to perch on. The two coops are covered on all sides and the top with reflective tarps with lots of air circulating around the coops. Lots of wind here even with the heat. Does canker kill that quickly? It was almost as if they were poisoned they all died so quickly yet all the others are fine. PS I also have a flock of up to 40 other ferals that hang out on the top of the coops and below waiting for seed to fall thru. During the heat of the day i can find 20 or so sleeping with their eyes closed on the coop and on the ground. I put a very large dish of water out for them and the left over seed from the coop feeding dishes. With Regards Graywolf

It may seem quick if they have had it for a while and you don't know they have it. As a natural defence, birds pretend to be OK even when they are not. A bird that act sick in the wild would stand out to a predator. Given birds pretend to be OK even if they aren't, you may not have noticed. Once we notice, the birds is very sick.
I believe wh have talked about Dr Hauck before and if memory serves me correctly, you did take one of your birds to see him some months back. He is a great resource in your area and has been wonderful about treating feral rescues.

Hi Charis What an incrediable memory you have. Yes i did take one of my first ferals to Dr Hauck here in las vegas. He confirmed what all on the board suggested was the cause of the head on backward syndrome. I had the meds on hand and he pulled thru just fine. He went on to breed with another young rescue and they raised one squeeker to adulthood. These are the three that got out one night and it took me 4 months and a new coop to get them back. They are still with me and the baby is now mated with another young feral. Looking foward to some more babys, but i was so upset by the loss of the last two, i want to be sure that i am doing everything i can to keep them all healthy. Will take a few pics and post tomorrow if i can. Thanks to all With Regards Graywolf

Looking forward to the pictures.

I tried a few ways to use the attach tab but i could not get it to work. Bet i am doing something really simple wrong. Can you point me in the right direction? Regards Fred S.

Hi Ferd,

Here's the link to the steps I take when posting pictures. Instructions for posting pictures

I hope this helps, and look forward to seeing your birds.

Thanks for all the suggestions on how to post pics. I am going to try again Regards Graywolf

Thanks you for all the help. Got the pics up. The cage with the sloped top opens all the way up on hinges so when i want to let them fly they can come and go. I do this once or twice a month. I always seem to get back one or two more then i let fly. How long does it take to imprint on a pigeon so it will always come back? I would love to build a bigger coop that can be cleaned more easily and safely hold more birds. At present i use a high pressure power washer under the big cage (wire cloth bottom) And scrape the cloth and perches each day. I have two that cant fly and seem to like to go into the closed age while th others are out. Its good because they are a bonded pair and i hope to have better luck if they lay eggs. Would love to hand raise so they would come to me and not be afraid on being held. Thanks again Regards Graywolf ( Fred S.)

Very nice cage set up Fred. Is the cage always in the blue tent or does the cage get natural sun light? If you have 2 pijjies that can't get out to fly it would be good for them to get some sun too... but I'm sure you know that.

We don't let any of our pigeons free fly but from what I understand there are a few different training 'steps' that have to be done. Putting a cage with the pigeons outside on the loft so they can see around the property & know what to look for when free flying home, is just one of them.

That's a nice cage, Fred. It reminds me of the one my son built for my Sammy and Romey.

While the cage I have for Sammy and Romey is about the same size, the alone are the occupants although it could house another couple.
Pigeons need a minimum of 2 1/2 square feet per bird although they do much better with a larger space. Having more space cuts down on squabbles.
Each couple need at least one nest box, although they like to have two. The ones I have are large enough so that both birds can comfortably sit in the box at the same time. My boxes have a lip across the bottom to keep the nesting material from fallen out. I give them Timothy Hay for nesting material and they love to arrange the pieces in the box. You can buy Timothy Hay in small bundles at the pet store in the rabbit section. If you do pick some up, buy a bag that has the longest pieces in it. You will have a ton of fun watching them with it.
If you have space to build a larger loft, one that you could walk into, that would be wonderful.

I know that food for feral pigeons in Las Vegas is difficult to come by and many that visit your place, finding food and water would be inclined to stay and continue to return. Certainly, any babies raised there would.

Thanks for all the kind words and suggestions. I have set up a Car cover frame on my back patio with heat reflective covers on the sides but some of the top is open for indirect sunlight just during the summer. The sun is so hot here it would boil the water off and probably cook the pigeons. When it cools off i take the top part off that way they get direct sunshine. In the desert we have misters for cooling the air outside. I put a few over one end of the open coop and its on a water timer. At 4 oclock it goes off and they all run to get under the mist for ten minutes, really cute to watch. They also like to take baths in the water bowls. I built some nesting boxs but now that i know they should be big enough for two i will rebuild them bigger. It would be great to have a coop large enough to walk in to but one reason i have them on my patio behind covers is that i got some complaints about keeping pigeons and we have CC&Rs that really dont allow it. So its been my little secret. That is except when i have 60 ferels on my roof sleeping. Its been in the news lately about the problems we have with pigeons on the Las Vegas strip. There is a company that goes out and traps them and then keeps then in a huge aviary. They claim we have 600,000 pigeons in the city. Starting in 2011 they are going to put out food at feed stations that will contain a birth control agent to humanely reduce the number of ferels. They claim other cities have done it and it works. Well see. With Regards Graywolf (Fred S.)

Fred...I love the misting idea. Several here do that when it's hot and the birds do enjoy it.

Matilda wrote:

Fred...I love the misting idea. Several here do that when it's hot and the birds do enjoy it.

I do too I want to have those in the new flights for use in the summer.

Can you recommend any companies that sell them online Fred? Or anyone else that uses them?

I was able to get mine at the HOME DEPOT here in Las Vegas. They come in all degrees of quality and cost. My set hooks up to a hose bib and i put a battery operated timer on the circuit, also a Home Depot item. The better mister kits ave brass or bronze nozzles on flexible nylon tubing. These will last for many years and not clog up with water sediment. It they do at all there is a cleaner wire with the kit to open them up. Hope this helps Regards Fred S PS I think Home Depot will do mail order anywhere in the country , if one is not close buy.

Thanks so much for the information Fred It does help alot 'cause now I know where to go to look at them!