Poopy pigeon has me baffled (not gaining weight)

Jaye...it's not PMV after all.

https://pij-n-angels.forumotion.net/pigeon-and-dove-illness-and-injury-discussion-forum-f21/prayers-and-wishes-of-wellness-needed-for-zoe-t1213.htm

I don't know but I can find out for you.

Anything new, Jaye?

...could they be stress related poops?

Yes, you can use Doxycline and Metronidazole simultaneously as follows:
Doxycline - 15 mg twice a day (no grit and calcium)
Metronidazole - 65 mg twice a day

By the way what do you feed him?

Jaye, a long shot here and I hope you don't mind me chiming in .... I've held back writing anything until all your test results were back because I know there are so many reasons why a bird can "go light". At this point though, I would agree with what Plamen wrote earlier, about witholding the safflower and/or any other high fat seeds or nuts...
I write this because I have one ringneck dove hen who just cannot tolerate the same amount of high fat oily seeds as my other (indoor) doves do in their diets without her poops becoming like you describe. She also happens to be the most nervous of my doves, so that may play a part, too...

But I also say "long shot" because unlike your pijii, she has not at any time been "going light" ...

If I withold the safflower, sunflower, peanuts and other high fat oily seeds/nuts and go instead with the parrot pellets with the probiotics in them, some spelt bread or smashed up spelt pretzels (no salt) and go more with seeds like milo and millet and for extra protein, chopped hard boiled egg or dried egg food, her poops will look entirely normal. She loves greens so I let her have some, but mostly either dried or those with a low moisture content...Now it's pretty much only when she gets upset or nervous, that the urine separates from the urates and feces like that.

Here are a couple of links with nutritional content of some seeds/nuts:

http://purgrain.com/ingredients.htm
http://www.squawkandhowl.com/info.html#seednut


Best wishes,

Just wondering here but like Carol has pointed out could the pij be allergic to a certain seed or seeds?

We have a few different species here that no matter how many test were done we could pin point the problem, until we started thinking about the foods they ate. I know its a pain in the neck but we had to start out with a very plain diet and add one by one the foods back to find the items that were causing the problems.

plamenh wrote:

Yes, you can use Doxycline and Metronidazole simultaneously as follows:
Doxycline - 15 mg twice a day (no grit and calcium)
Metronidazole - 65 mg twice a day

By the way what do you feed him?

Plamen...that's a pretty high dose for metronidazole.

The recommended dose is as follows;

Metronidazole/Flagyl

Dose 20-50 mgs per kilo twice daily or 40-100mgs per kilo Once daily) 14 days.
[ kilo=1000 grams...a Homer sized Pigeon is about 495 grams]
This recommendation was taken from the resource forum at PT. Many veterinarians actually prescribe a dose that is lower.

If over dosed on metronidazole the bird can have siezures. I do know of a Pigeon that died from given a high dose, so I would advise caution with this drug.

Has his poop always been the way it is now?

I know it is higher than recomended and I would not give this figures if I wasn't sure.
This is what I used on Aramis recently when Flagyl was used not for Canker but for internal bacterial infection in combination with Synulox. 1/3 Flagyl 200 tablet twice a day. I had very same argument with Dr. Russell and he explained me that recomended dosages on medications are often too low to have any effect.



This is the Aramis' prescription for Flagyl

plamenh wrote:

I know it is higher than recomended and I would not give this figures if I wasn't sure.
This is what I used on Aramis recently when Flagyl was used not for Canker but for internal bacterial infection in combination with Synulox. 1/3 Flagyl 200 tablet twice a day. I had very same argument with Dr. Russell and he explained me that recomended dosages on medications are often too low to have any effect.



This is the Aramis' prescription for Flagyl

Here's the yes but... the dosage should be based on wight of each bird. Givine 65mg to a 180 gram bird could be fatal. That's why there is a range, such as...20-50mg.

Jaye wrote:

Ok - he had the fecal and microbactera tests today - results expected Tuesday. Some good news - he hasn't lost any weight over the past week (first time that has happened in the past 4 weeks !)

That is some good news. I hope that there finally is some resovle with this one. I can understand how it could drive you nuts.
You remember my lttile yellow parrot and how thin he is...he's been this way since I rescued him 17 years ago.He has been examined and tested by 3 different vets, none of which could figure out why he is so thin. I had to let go of it because it was making me nuts.

180 is pretty low, Aramis was 263 in his lowest point.

Curious...was this bird on metacame or advill?

Jaye wrote:

Ok - he had the fecal and microbactera tests today - results expected Tuesday.

Some good news - he hasn't lost any weight over the past week (first time that has happened in the past 4 weeks !)

That is good news.

How is he feeling today....

Honestly...I wouldn't give him anything but the medistatin.
Oddly, I did read something today, on a Dutch forum, about a couple of male Pigeons that were having similar symptoms as this guy. Apparently, the symptoms had only begun a few days ago. The veterinaran that was moderating the forum thought it could be because the birds are nervous or stress related.
I did think of this guy when I read that as I have wondered the same over the course of his saga.
Certainly, you have gone the extra mile and a dozen more to find out what's going on with him. I admire your committment and determination on his behalf.

A lot of times, one can pick up a very nice gram scale at, Tuesday Mornings, for under $20. There are good to have and saves one sneaking into the UPS store on a frequent basis.

Appreciate the update, Jaye. :Yes:

This little one truly is a puzzler, isn't she?
You have done, and are doing, an incredible job of trying to find a diagnosis for what's going on, as well as giving her the utmost care.

Positive thoughts and best wishes continue.
As time permits, please keep us posted.

Charis,

All of these poop images - Bank poops look like these.
But yet lab result is negative.

What should I do?

Tech/Jo