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 Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!

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Irene
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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeMon Oct 25, 2010 4:25 pm

Here are some photos of little Comis and his droppings (I hope this time I manage to post them sucessfully!)

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NiteOwl
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NiteOwl

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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeMon Oct 25, 2010 4:42 pm

Be careful not to stuff him too full. Feed him until his crop feels like a soft pillow. Not over stuffed. You can stretch out the crop, and then it can have problems emptying. Remember to wait until it empties before feeding again. Very cute little bird.
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Matilda
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Matilda

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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeMon Oct 25, 2010 6:29 pm

It does look like he has an infection going on combined with starvation droppings.
I think the drug combination you are using...baytril and metronidazole is good.

He is adorable.
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Teresa
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Teresa

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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeMon Oct 25, 2010 9:02 pm

I totally agree with Charis.
When you first mentioned 'spaghetti' poops, I expected to see something quite different. Those in the photos are the type of poops that people describe as looking like an artist's oil paint: bright darkish green, shiny, greasy looking, and they're a sign of starvation. Either the baby hasn't been managing to eat enough, or an infection is not allowing the food to be absorbed properly. So it's best to give him the medication directly rather than in a grain of corn or a pea, to make sure it gets absorbed.
I hope that you'll see an improvement in Comis in the morning. He is just adorable! I love it/them
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AZWhitefeather
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AZWhitefeather

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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeMon Oct 25, 2010 10:57 pm

Thank you for sharing the pictures of Comis with us, Irene.
Such a sweet little one. Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 983488
I will be thinking the best possible thoughts that he begins to show signs of improvement very soon. Fingers crossed

Bless you both. Pigeon angel

_________________
Cindy

A Pigeon's Prayer
Please watch over us while we fly,
Keeping us safe from the predators that share the sky.

If we become ill or injured in any way,
Please lead us to safety where we are welcome to stay.
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Irene
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Posts : 132
Join date : 2010-05-01
Age : 46
Location : Venice, Italy

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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeTue Oct 26, 2010 3:36 am

Goodmorning (or goodevening -if it is evening in your countries...)!

here it is 11am and this morning Comis looks much better! For the first time in the last 3 days he managed to get up and stand up on his feet for a while, that's a very good sign! He seems more lively and a little stronger! I fed him about 50 peas and his metronidazole dose. I can't understand when he is full because his crop always feels quite hard and I'm too afraid to press him in case I cause him pain... But when he is full he stops swallowing the peas, shakes his head and spits them out and he resists strongly... In this way I understand that he can't eat more... When he is empty, he swallows the wet peas willingly when I put them in his mouth and he doesn't resist at all! He is a very well behaved little bird...! I'm glad you liked his photos and find him adorable... He really is! :-) His droppings have changed the last days (when his illness manifested itself...). His poops used to be spaggetti-like in a pool of sticky slimy greenish liquid... But now they look more like 'oil paints' as you said... It's strange that they indicate starving because Comis was eating well enough... (though the last days he was eating less and he finally stopped eating at all when he became 'paralysed' and couldn't stand on his feet anymore...). But now that I forcefeed him, he continues to do the kind of poops that you saw in the photos... Is that a sign that he has worms or other parasites inside him? Poor baby, how knows how many things he has got...!
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pigeonwriter
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pigeonwriter

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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeTue Oct 26, 2010 5:03 am

Irene - your poop photos look exactly like the ones I have had with my ferals. Your medication should take care of that quite soon - I am sure your little one will recover again. In order to give hime some variety and easy digesting I recommend tube feeding him baby cereal with riceflakes and applesauce for human babies. The calories in these baby cereals will help the little one to increase weight again and supply with minerals and vitamins. Try to get one without any milk.

When your medication is finished I strongly recommend a probiotic: bird bene bac or bene bac. It is a gel that can be given directly from the small tube into the bird's beak. Apparently it tastes very wel.This will help to "repair" his intestines again. This was the only stuff that helped our Pina (severe PMV infection) to regain a healthy digestion after a 9 months PMV infection! It also helps to add pro-biotic joghurt to the food.

Wishing you and your bird all the best. Universal hug Universal hug Universal hug
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AZWhitefeather
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AZWhitefeather

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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeTue Oct 26, 2010 7:21 am

Hi Irene, Hi there/Bye
Many thanks for your update. Smile
I'm thrilled that Comis is showing signs of feeling some better and especially happy to hear that he even stood a bit on his own. YESS!! Hip Hip Hooray

Will keep the positive thoughts going and fingers crossed Fingers crossed for continued improvement. Circle of Love

_________________
Cindy

A Pigeon's Prayer
Please watch over us while we fly,
Keeping us safe from the predators that share the sky.

If we become ill or injured in any way,
Please lead us to safety where we are welcome to stay.
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Matilda
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Matilda

Posts : 9198
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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeTue Oct 26, 2010 8:36 am

Irene...I would think that within the next day or so, he should be eating on his own. Still you must watch him closely to make sure he is eating enough. Enough in theis case would be 40-50 peas, three times a day.
Anothere thing you need to ask your pharmacy about is, nystatin oral suspension. If you can find it, I would recomend, o.3 cc, morning and eventing. It will keep him from getting a yeast infection.
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NiteOwl
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NiteOwl

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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeTue Oct 26, 2010 3:48 pm

Irene wrote:
Goodmorning (or goodevening -if it is evening in your countries...)!

here it is 11am and this morning Comis looks much better! For the first time in the last 3 days he managed to get up and stand up on his feet for a while, that's a very good sign! He seems more lively and a little stronger! I fed him about 50 peas and his metronidazole dose. I can't understand when he is full because his crop always feels quite hard and I'm too afraid to press him in case I cause him pain... But when he is full he stops swallowing the peas, shakes his head and spits them out and he resists strongly... In this way I understand that he can't eat more... When he is empty, he swallows the wet peas willingly when I put them in his mouth and he doesn't resist at all! He is a very well behaved little bird...! I'm glad you liked his photos and find him adorable... He really is! :-) His droppings have changed the last days (when his illness manifested itself...). His poops used to be spaggetti-like in a pool of sticky slimy greenish liquid... But now they look more like 'oil paints' as you said... It's strange that they indicate starving because Comis was eating well enough... (though the last days he was eating less and he finally stopped eating at all when he became 'paralysed' and couldn't stand on his feet anymore...). But now that I forcefeed him, he continues to do the kind of poops that you saw in the photos... Is that a sign that he has worms or other parasites inside him? Poor baby, how knows how many things he has got...!


His crop shouldn't feel hard. When it is empty, it's empty. But when you feed him, you can feel it filling up like a soft little pillow. If it is hard and packed after feeding, then you are probably giving him too much. Do you let it empty before feeding him?
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Matilda
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Matilda

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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeWed Oct 27, 2010 10:01 am

Irene...how is Comis doing?
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Irene
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Posts : 132
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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeWed Oct 27, 2010 6:34 pm

Hi to all the wonderful people here!

I wanted to write to you much earlier but I've been very busy these days... Well, I have very good news to tell you!! :-) Comis is recovering very fast!! He can now stand on his feet again, he has started walking and he is even exercirsing his wings!! Today, for the first time in his life, he managed to fly from the chair to the floor! I'm extremely happy for him!! :-) I continue to give him his medicines and I'll try to find also the oral suspension that Matilda suggested! His droppings have started to look more normal! He is still not eating by himself, although sometimes he tries to pick up a lentil or two from his plate... I have put him a mixture of seeds: wheat, rice, corn, and small brown lentils, but I continue to forcefeed him peas. I can't understand when his crop is full or empty... To say the truth, I'm not sure where exactly is his crop... Is it under his beak or further down, at his chest? He is very fluffy and I can't even feel his skin... He is like a little hairy ball!

Dear 'Pigeonwriter' I'm so glad that your beloved Pina has also recovered from the terrible PMV infection...! This is an extremely dangerous disease and I'm sure that she needed a lot of care and patience, so she was very lucky that she was in your good hands!

As for me, I'm now worried about my other 6 pigeons in case they have got the diseases of Comis too (because they were all in the same space, eating and drinking from the same plates...) I see that his parents Meli (a feral pigeon) and Anemoni (a Pavoncello dove) both have diarhoea and their droppings look like mud, they are light brown with foam and look thick and slimy... They also have a bad smell. Meli and Anemoni have laid eggs again and they stay in their nest all the time, so I don't know if this influences their droppings, but I'm worried for them and for the babies that are still in the eggs... Should I give any medicines to Comis's parents too? They both seem to be lively and healthy, but Meli (the father) eats very little (he eats only the small seeds and he often spits them out. He only likes pumpkin seeds and he is crazy for them but unfortunately I can't find them in the shops... I just buy him bread that contains these seeds and he picks them up from the bread with great joy! As for my other pigeons (the other babies of Meli who are now grown ups) they all seem fine but one of them, Cinderella, laid a very strange egg that was empty inside and its surface looked very rough... Could they all be ill? What should I do to protect them? Thank you so much for your precious help! Comis is revived thanks to you!! Words cannot express my gratefulness to you... You are saving innocent souls, God bless you! :-)

Lots of love,
Irene


Irene
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Matilda
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Matilda

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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeWed Oct 27, 2010 7:24 pm

That's wonderful news!

I do think you should treat all your birds and I also think you should not let any more babies hatch until you know everyone is in the best of health. Most of us replace the eggs, after they are laid with wooden ones, so the parents will continue the incubation process but no more babies hatch.

The crop is located between the base of the pigeon's neck and the top of the keel bone which is in the center of the bird. The crop is like a little balloon and when it is full, you can feel the lumpy food in there. When you hand feed Comis, put the fingers on one hand, just above that center bone and you will be able to feel the food as it goes into the crop.

The bumpy egg you described may be the result of the hen not having enough calcium to make nice strong eggs. Unless the birds are outside and can soak in the rays of the sun, they also need to be supplemented with vitaminD which is needed for the body to process the calcium. Offer them ouster shell, in a separate dish and look for vitaminD a the pet store.

Birds that have been incubating eggs, hold their poop until they get off the nest. The result is one big stinky poop...wet and kind of slimy. Could be that is in part what you are seeing.
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NiteOwl
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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeWed Oct 27, 2010 8:51 pm

Thanks for the update Irene. I'm glad he is doing better now. Hope he continues to improve. As Charis has said, they will all need to be treated, and more babies should wait til you are sure that everyone is healthy. Most things pigeons can pick up will spread through the whole flock, so if one is sick, then normally you would treat everyone. But I'm glad he's doing better.
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Teresa
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Teresa

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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeWed Oct 27, 2010 10:19 pm

I'm so happy to hear that Comis is better! cheers
Please keep us posted.
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Luna Wolf
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Luna Wolf

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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeWed Oct 27, 2010 11:05 pm

Here's a picture of where the crop is. (Actually might be on the right, sometimes photographs are flipped. Whichever side sticks farther is the crop.)Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Crop10
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Matilda
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Matilda

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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeWed Oct 27, 2010 11:14 pm

High 5 ...Luna... Thank You thanks
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AZWhitefeather
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AZWhitefeather

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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeWed Oct 27, 2010 11:28 pm

Thanks for the wonderful update, Irene.
I am so glad to hear Comis is improving more and more. YESS!!

Please keep us posted.

_________________
Cindy

A Pigeon's Prayer
Please watch over us while we fly,
Keeping us safe from the predators that share the sky.

If we become ill or injured in any way,
Please lead us to safety where we are welcome to stay.
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Irene
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Age : 46
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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeThu Oct 28, 2010 6:33 am

Thank you for explaining me where the crop is! So, do you think I should give the same medicines to all of my pigeons (that is Metronidazole in the morning and Baytril in the evening)? What would be the right doses for adult pigeons?

As for the eggs of Meli and Anemoni (Comis' parents), it's too late to remove them now because they have been warming them for two weeks and they are about to hatch... Fortunately my other pigeons (which are all of them babies of Meli and Anemoni) are sterile because they are a crossbreed between two different species. As for the fertile eggs of Meli and Anemoni I wanted to throw them away because I already have too many pigeons and I don't have any space for more and I actually destroyed the first of their two eggs. But then I felt very guilty and sad because I was thinking that I killed an innocent soul and I couldn't destroy the second egg... So I let it in the nest and I put one of the infertile eggs of the other pigeons next to it so that Meli and Anemoni think that they have both of their eggs safe... I'm too sensitive and I don't know what to do... Now the fertile egg is about to hatch and probably the little one will be ill like Comis and his sister Laithi that died... It may not even survive, who knows... but let's see...

I have put some oyster shell sand for my pigeons but they don't eat it... As for the sun, they have plenty of it, because their cage is infront of the window (which is really huge! The whole wall is a window). Their cage is also huge (2m high, 2m long, 1m wide) with many shelves and nests so they can move to the sunny parts or to the shadowy ones as they prefer. Today I took Comis out of his box and put him on the table to sunbath. I thought it may cheer him up! He became more lively and started walking on the table and exploring around! It gives me great joy to see him getting better and stronger! :-)
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Irene
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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeThu Oct 28, 2010 6:41 am

Here are some photos of Comis (whose name means 'noble man' in Greek, because he looks so elegant...) this morning making his first steps on the table! :-)

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AZWhitefeather
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AZWhitefeather

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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeThu Oct 28, 2010 8:12 am

I can't thank you enough for posting the pictures, Irene. flower
Comis is stunning and his surroundings are beautiful (I LOVE the little girl on the bicycle). I love it/them
Comis is looking wonderful. Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 142829

I will be thinking positive thoughts that all goes well with the upcoming babies. Fingers crossed

_________________
Cindy

A Pigeon's Prayer
Please watch over us while we fly,
Keeping us safe from the predators that share the sky.

If we become ill or injured in any way,
Please lead us to safety where we are welcome to stay.
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EgypSwiftLady
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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeThu Oct 28, 2010 8:30 am


What a cutie pie! I love it/them So glad to hear Comis is getting better.
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Matilda
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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeThu Oct 28, 2010 9:22 am

Irene...what cross breeds do you have?

You can treat the couple with metronidazol before the babies hatch, as for the batril...I would wait.
The dosage you give the others will depend on their weight. If you post the weights, we can help you figure out the best dosage amounts.
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Irene
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Posts : 132
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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeThu Oct 28, 2010 3:42 pm

I'm so glad that you share my joy for little Comis who is recovering...! He is lovely, I'm so proud of him...! :-) When he stands among the toys, he looks like one of them, but he is the cutest of all! :-) The new egg of Comis' parents hatched just two hours ago and a tiny baby came out of the egg! So Comis has got a new sister or brother who will take the place of poor Laithi, his sister who died... Let's hope it survives!

Charis, I will weigh my pigeons tomorrow (now it is night here and they are sleeping) and I will tell you their exact weight, so as to calculate what is the right dose of Metronidazole for them... Thank you so much! As for my cross breeds, Comis is one of them. His father is a feral pigeon and his mother an exotic fantail dove. It's amazing that they became a couple although they are so different... In the beginning they fought all the time, but when I took them to Greece (my home country) for holidays and they found themselves in a different environment, they fell in love with each other...! Since then, they have been inseparable and they have had 10 babies, of which only the six survive. So Comis and all his brothers and sisters are cross breeds. They are all black like ravens or black with white patches, except for Comis, and they look more like ordinary pigeons rather than show doves... The great thing is that they are sterile because they have a mutation in their genes and this is very convenient to me as I live in a one room flat and I don't have much space...

Here are two photos of Meli ('Honey') and Anemoni ('Brought by the wind'), the parents of Comis, during our holidays in Greece... :-)

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AZWhitefeather
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PostSubject: Re: Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill!   Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 Icon_minitimeThu Oct 28, 2010 3:53 pm

Meli and Anemoni are beautiful, Irene. Help! My little pigeon is seriously ill! - Page 2 142829
Thanks for sharing them with us. Happy Dance

I hope the baby does well. Circle of Love
Please keep us posted.

_________________
Cindy

A Pigeon's Prayer
Please watch over us while we fly,
Keeping us safe from the predators that share the sky.

If we become ill or injured in any way,
Please lead us to safety where we are welcome to stay.
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