Horrible fracture (Beware, GRAPHIC) -- what can I do?

Cynthia wrote:

Hi Teresa,

I am ashamed, I couldn't look at this thread, I had such a horrific image in my mind, I didn't think I could help....I am so relieved that thanks to your involvement he will be all right he will be all right!

Cynthia

Aw, Cynthia, we all have moments when we can't handle more bad news! But I haven't forgotten how you were a tower of strength to me as I struggled to help Merlin.

Just to remind you, and to add another story with a happy ending, I posted Merlin's story (without the scary photos!):

https://pij-n-angels.forumotion.net/feral-pigeons-and-doves-f3/there-you-are-t647.htm#6638

I love happy endings!
Now, because you are on Baytril, calcium for bone mending is not appropriate.
You can use single dose Baytril as per Charis’ suggestion in the morning for example and some of the following:
Arnica: This remedy is useful for reducing the pain and swelling that accompany any new injury, and should be taken as soon as possible after a break occurs. It may also be helpful in calming the bird, since breaking a bone is traumatic as well as painful. Dose 1~2 tablets a day. Arnica may be used for several days while pain and soreness are prominent.
Symphytum: This remedy is best known for helping broken bones rejoin and heal. It should be taken after a bone is set to ensure proper joining of the bone. (A common recommendation is to take it daily in the first few days, then once a week while the bone is healing.)

Hi Teresa,

Just a reminder (as the dose Charis recommends indicates) that the Baytril dose for pigeons is 10-20 mg per kilo bodyweight once every 24 hours.

The 2.5% solution that I use has 2.5 mg per 0.1 ml, so if you are using that would be roughly 0.3 ml, but it is important to check what solution the vet gives you.

I love it when pigeons crow triumphantly as they are returned to somewhere that they feel safe and at ahome.

plamenh wrote:

Arnica: This remedy is useful for reducing the pain and swelling that accompany any new injury, and should be taken as soon as possible after a break occurs. It may also be helpful in calming the bird, since breaking a bone is traumatic as well as painful. Dose 1~2 tablets a day. Arnica may be used for several days while pain and soreness are prominent.
Symphytum: This remedy is best known for helping broken bones rejoin and heal. It should be taken after a bone is set to ensure proper joining of the bone. (A common recommendation is to take it daily in the first few days, then once a week while the bone is healing.)

I'm glad you posted that info as I'm using Symphytum at present for one of my dogs to encourage a bone fusion after an op. I wasn't sure how long and often to use after the first few days. Very good to find someone who has some experience of this.

This is such a wonderful story, if only there more vets like yours, it's so heartening to know there are those that will treat pigeons with as much care as any other patient.

Looking forward to watching his progress.

Janet

plamenh wrote:

I love happy endings!
Now, because you are on Baytril, calcium for bone mending is not appropriate.
You can use single dose Baytril as per Charis’ suggestion in the morning for example and some of the following:
Arnica: This remedy is useful for reducing the pain and swelling that accompany any new injury, and should be taken as soon as possible after a break occurs. It may also be helpful in calming the bird, since breaking a bone is traumatic as well as painful. Dose 1~2 tablets a day. Arnica may be used for several days while pain and soreness are prominent.
Symphytum: This remedy is best known for helping broken bones rejoin and heal. It should be taken after a bone is set to ensure proper joining of the bone. (A common recommendation is to take it daily in the first few days, then once a week while the bone is healing.)

Thanks, Plamenh, I've still got some arnica, and I'll look for Symphytum tomorrow.

Cynthia wrote:

Hi Teresa,

Just a reminder (as the dose Charis recommends indicates) that the Baytril dose for pigeons is 10-20 mg per kilo bodyweight once every 24 hours.

The 2.5% solution that I use has 2.5 mg per 0.1 ml, so if you are using that would be roughly 0.3 ml, but it is important to check what solution the vet gives you.

I love it when pigeons crow triumphantly as they are returned to somewhere that they feel safe and at ahome.

Thanks for the clarification, Cynthia, I'd noted down the info incorrectly but I've now put it right.

Hercules is doing okay, but he's probably very sore as he's a bit cranky and his appetite wasn't brilliant.
I'll upload some more pics tomorrow.

I'm sure he isn't feeling real chipper just yet.
Sending you 'special get well wishes ' Hercules, for a speedy recovery.
We will be looking forward to more photos.

I'm sure he feels sore. Baytril can take the appetite away too.

How was his first day after operation?

First day after the operation, he was still Mr. Attitude:



But he was a bit quiet and cranky, and his appetite wasn't brilliant. However, he enjoyed being picked up and held so that his sore leg dangled free. He was very good about taking his medicine and sipping a little chamomile tea with honey. He was curious about his surroundings and interested in Piper and Rambo. I love the way he looks you straight in the eye, quite unafraid, as if he's giving you marks out of ten!

The following day he'd got fed up of resting his crop on his 'pillow', so he decided to stand on it instead and dangle his leg. He's moving around more and the colour of his bad foot is SO much better! And I don't know if it was a trick of the light, but I would have sworn I saw him move two toes on that foot.
As soon as he was out of the basket he started stretching out his neck as if preparing to fly, so I now have to wedge him under my chin to have a free hand to change his bedding etc. :Rolling eyes:



OMG, I can hear him grooming right now!!! What a bird!

Fabulous and he looks so much better.

plamenh wrote:

Arnica: This remedy is useful for reducing the pain and swelling that accompany any new injury, and should be taken as soon as possible after a break occurs. It may also be helpful in calming the bird, since breaking a bone is traumatic as well as painful. Dose 1~2 tablets a day. Arnica may be used for several days while pain and soreness are prominent.

I haven't been able to get hold of Arnica in tablet form. (The one I used for Penny was a gel for external use). The health food shop sold me an oral solution, but I'm worried about some of the components, and the information in the leaflet is sketchy at best. Please have a look and tell me whether you think it's safe for pigeons.
Components per 100g: Arnica montana D3 5g; Bryonia cretica D4 5g; Acidum benzoicum and resin D3 5g; Colchicum autumnale D4 5g; Mercurialis perenis D3 5g; Eupatorium cannabinum D4 5g; Solanum lycopersicum D3 5g; Echinacea angustifolia D3 5g; Rhus toxicodendron D6 10g; Eucalyptus globulus D4 10g; Baptisia tinctoria D4 10g; Solanum nigrum D4 10g; Solanum dulcamara D4 10g; Apis mellifica D4 10g; Contains alcohol at 35%.
Dosage: For adult people, 10 drops (and for young babies 3 drops) 3 times a day (to a maximum of 12 times a day), diluted in a little water. The bottle is a drop-counter and contains 30ml of solution.

Quote :

Symphytum: This remedy is best known for helping broken bones rejoin and heal. It should be taken after a bone is set to ensure proper joining of the bone. (A common recommendation is to take it daily in the first few days, then once a week while the bone is healing.)

The health food shop didn't know this one at all. I'll need to look further afield.

Arnica - try 1 drop a day.
Comfrey (Symphytum officinale L.) Knitbone, they should know it under consolda-maior
If you check the picture, you'll see that he is using toes on his leg so there is some sensitivity there.
It is great that he is doing well.

Rambo is looking much better, Teresa.
Appreciate the updated pictures.

Please do keep us posted.

plamenh wrote:

Arnica - try 1 drop a day.

Will do. Many thanks!

Quote :

Comfrey (Symphytum officinale L.) Knitbone, they should know it under consolda-maior

My goodness, you are an encyclopaedia! I'll go back to the shop in a moment.

Quote :

If you check the picture, you'll see that he is using toes on his leg so there is some sensitivity there.
It is great that he is doing well.

Ah, so I wasn't seeing things! I'm so thrilled!

plamenh wrote:

Comfrey (Symphytum officinale L.) Knitbone, they should know it under consolda-maior

One shop I tried knew it as 'consolda-maior' and usually have it as tea, but it's out of stock and may take two weeks to arrive.

Another knew it as 'comfrey', but they only have it as a secondary ingredient in an aloe vera gel for external use. They asked what I wanted it for, and recommended Tecoma impetiginosa ('Pau d'Arco', I've actually got some in the house already) and Silicea Balsam (Silicic acid gel with 2.8% silicon dioxide [quartz?!]).
Is any of that any good?

Tabebuia impetiginosa - 'Pau d'Arco' has antimicrobial and antiimflammatory properties. You can use it in Candida and bacterial infections.

I would leave it only on Arnica.

Wow Teresa,your little Hercules looks soooo much better that I can hardly believe it.
You have done such a wonderful job! You are a true

plamenh wrote:

Tabebuia impetiginosa - 'Pau d'Arco' has antimicrobial and antiimflammatory properties. You can use it in Candida and bacterial infections.

I would leave it only on Arnica.

Will do, thank you so much!

Today's pics:





He must be feeling a lot more comfortable, because he's getting restless! :boing:
I'm just concerned about his poops, which are very liquid. Can that be a consequence of the trauma or the operation?

Teresa wrote:

* He must be feeling a lot more comfortable, because he's getting restless!

I'm just concerned about his poops, which are very liquid.
** Can that be a consequence of the trauma or the operation?

* It does sound like he's feeling better.

** I think it certainly could be a factor. The poor little guy has been through a lot.
How is his eating coming along?

Try to give him brown rice with the seeds. It will firm his poop. Baytril afect poop too.
I'm glad that he is so perky.

He's eating reasonably well, but drinking lots, so this could be a factor as well. And his diet is also different from what he was getting in the park (corn and bread, I suppose). I've started putting a little more corn with his seeds, and I will add some brown rice -- thanks for the tip!

He's a model patient! Although he grunts and wingslaps sometimes if I move too quickly, he enjoys being held and sips his medication drop by drop, in a very dignified way, like he knows it's good for him. I've been massaging his bad foot every day, but I haven't felt any of the toes move yet.

Teresa wrote:

He's eating reasonably well, but drinking lots, so this could be a factor as well. And his diet is also different from what he was getting in the park (corn and bread, I suppose). I've started putting a little more corn with his seeds, and I will add some brown rice -- thanks for the tip!

He's a model patient! Although he grunts and wingslaps sometimes if I move too quickly, he enjoys being held and sips his medication drop by drop, in a very dignified way, like he knows it's good for him. I've been massaging his bad foot every day, but I haven't felt any of the toes move yet.

Now that's a good patient.