No rest for the wicked

Velvet's necropsy

My vet has received the preliminary results for Velvet's necropsy. She mentioned major organ failure: all major organs and small intestine showing pathogenic alterations and white lesions (Aspergillosis is the main suspect, just as Charis thought) which are undergoing further study (microscope examination and cultures). There were parasites (unspecified) in the gizzard and the lungs; as he had been given Ivermectin, we are waiting to find out which parasites.

The vet was incredibly understanding. She said that Aspergillosis is a major killer of pet birds round here (damp seaside air) and the source can usually be traced to infected packets of bird food. She added that if the bird is already weakened or has a compromised imune system (like Velvet, recovering from PMV) the smallest amount can victimise it with such speed that there's nothing anyone can do. She has lost several patients to it, parrots who didn't recover even after starting treatment. With symptoms being so vague, by the time a diagnosis was made it was too late.

I really wanted answers, but I confess going over all this was rather upsetting. On the other hand this allows me to be extra vigilant with the other pigeons, and I also had some excellent news about George.

New pidjy:

I'm also getting a new pidjy: a tiny squeaker someone took in, malnourished and with GI infection. As the vet doesn't expect the rescuer to want any more to do with her, she asked me if, when the treatment is over and she's put on a bit more weight, I will take the baby and look after her until she learns to fly and fend for herself. Naturally, I said yes.

Teresa, this sounds so terribly discouraging on one side because it confirms that even if you do the utmost for a little patient it still could not just be enough or quickly enough. On the other hand it also confirms that you just have dine everything you could have done. If all the symptoms were easier to read and interpret it would be so much easier to heal any bird but this is not the case.
Each day when I look into the boxes of my sweet PMV pijjies I am a bit anxious to see them well and am relieved when I realize that they had a good night. I wished this were always guaranteed...

Good luck and for your new pijjie!

Teresa...Aspergillosis is common here too with our damp climate and because the symptoms can be similar to bacterial infections, the tendency is to give antibiotics which only make the fungus grow. It's very frustrating. I'm sorry this was Velvet's fate. Thanks for teling us what you found out. It helps us learn.

I'm anxious to hear about the new baby. Babies are always good.

Teresa...I was just researching Aspergillosis a bit more and found the following...



ASPERGILLOSIS

OCCURRENCE

All species of birds are susceptible.

ETIOLOGY

Aspergillus fumigatus

EPIZOOTIOLOGY

Infection usually occurs after inhalation of large numbers of
spores from heavily contaminated feed or litter which overwhelms
the resistance of the bird.

Aspergillus can penetrate egg shells under ideal conditions and
infect the embryo. Such eggs may appear green when candled.
Infected embryos may hatch with well developed lesions.

CLINICAL SIGNS

Dyspnea, gasping, accelerated breathing, diarrhea, anorexia,
somnolence, progressive emaciation and increased thirst.

If metastasis to the brain has occurred, signs of CNS disturbance
may be seen.

If metastasis to the globe has occurred, one or both may have a
gray-white opacity.

LESIONS

Yellow or gray nodules and/or plaques in the lungs, air sacs, or
trachea; less often in the peritoneal cavity, liver, or at other
sites.

http://netvet.wustl.edu/species/birds/aviandis.txt

Thank you so much for posting about the finding on Velvet's necropsy.
It is hard to hear, but at the same time it's information we can all benefit from.

Will be looking forward to hearing more about the baby.

Voriconazole treatment for Aspergillosis

Oral dosage schedules of 10 mg/kg BW twice a day or 20 mg/kg BW once a
day is most appropriate in treating pigeons with aspergillosis.

(5 mg per pigeon per day)

Medical Mycology May 2009

Department of Pharmacology, Faculty of Veterinary Medicine,
University of Murcia, Campus de Espinardo, Murcia, Spain

Voriconazole brand name - Vfend (Pfizer)

Drug description:
Voriconazole is used to treat serious fungal infections such as invasive aspergillosis (a fungal infection that begins in the lungs and spreads through the bloodstream to other organs) and esophageal candidiasis (infection by a yeast-like fungus that may cause white patching in the mouth and throat). Voriconazole is in a class of antifungal medications called triazoles.

Warning:
Do not mix Voriconazole with other drugs or herbal remedies especially St. John's wort

Velvet's necropsis: The vet phoned through the results of the remaining tests -- it wasn't Aspergillosis after all, the white lesions in the major organs were viral, but they didn't test which virus. The parasites found in the gizzard* and lungs** were 'nematodes' (I think that's roundworms, I'll have to check) and there was also a secondary bacterial infection which caused acute pneumonia.

The worm problem will need further attention, because the instructions on the wormer I'd given him said it provided protection for a month, but it looks as though the treatment should have been repeated 12 days later.
I hope I can get a copy of the report on my next visit.

Piper and Hercules on Nystatin: Hercules' sneezing (which started after the second operation) got worse, and Piper (who always sneezes for a few days at this time of the year) also started wheezing at night. I decided not to take any risks and put them both on Nystatin on Wednesday evening. They also get cinnamon tea in the morning. Over the last 24 hours, Piper only sneezed once and Hercules not at all.

Hercules underweight: He's still round the 300g mark, thin enough that you can feel the keel a little, which is bad news. He's been eating less as his mind contemplates romance, and he's also still moulting. The poops are less in quantity than they should be, so I'm presuming he's simply not eating enough. I've been hand feeding him peas and corn (and bits of my fingers!) for two days, after which he can pick what he wants from his feeder.
Either way, he's due for his monthly worming next week, and after what happened to Velvet, I'm going to worm him again 12 days after that, and then wait a longer time interval. Any thoughts?


* Gizzard Worm or Amidostomum Anseris
** Gapeworm or Syngamus trachea Treatment with Ivermectin: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gapeworm

"There are no effective treatments for gizzard worms or gapeworms":http://www.dpi.qld.gov.au/27_2745.htm

I know it's difficult, Teresa but I really appreciate you posting this information. As I result of your willingness to share, I dug deeper about fungus and parasites last evening and have clarified some issues for myself.
Thank you.

Matilda wrote:

I know it's difficult, Teresa but I really appreciate you posting this information. ... Thank you.

Me too, Theresa
Best wishes,
Carol

What wormer do you use? I would also carry with cinnamon tea for three days, then one day fresh water and tea again.
Pity they didn't tell you what virus.

plamenh wrote:

What wormer do you use? I would also carry with cinnamon tea for three days, then one day fresh water and tea again.
Pity they didn't tell you what virus.

I found a similar article last night on Hepes virus.

Teresa,
I am so sorry about these setbacks especially after all Hercules has been through. I send you all my healing wishes so that this chapter may be closed soon and Hercules can fully recover. I am feeling with you

Although your update is greatly appreciated, Teresa, I'm sorry there have been a couple steps backward.
My positive thoughts continue that all will get back on the right track.

Thank you all for your help and support.

plamenh wrote:

What wormer do you use?

Beaphor Spot On for medium-sized birds. The composition is Ivermectin.

Quote :

I would also carry with cinnamon tea for three days, then one day fresh water and tea again.

Many thanks, I'll do that.

Quote :

Pity they didn't tell you what virus.

Yes indeed, I would like to know which one, especially because of Sammy. His unusual markings and colouring are so like Velvet's that they could easily be related.
I believe they didn't have the capacity to investigate further.

I read the article you found carefully, but the signs weren't present: there was no discolouration of the wattles, he didn't sneeze, there was no nasal discharge and no conjunctivitis.

Symptom history: On the day I found him in the park, he was staggering and stargazing. Must have been doing that for a while, cause the feathers on he back of his neck were worn down. He was riddled with ectoparasites, and that was the first time I actually saw blood-sucking mites.
He never stargazed again until close to the end, but his head always tilted a little to the right.
He had pronouced polyuria, and drank excessively all the time. During the last few days he looked fluffed-up or even puffed-up, and he was losing weight. Three days before the end his urates turned yellow.
Respiratory problems started in the last few hours, after he'd been sick, and I believe the two are related.

I really, really hope this never happens again.

Teresa wrote:

Thank you all for your help and support.

Symptom history: On the day I found him in the park, he was staggering and stargazing. Must have been doing that for a while, cause the feathers on he back of his neck were worn down. He was riddled with ectoparasites, and that was the first time I actually saw blood-sucking mites.
He never stargazed again until close to the end, but his head always tilted a little to the right.
He had pronouced polyuria, and drank excessively all the time. During the last few days he looked fluffed-up or even puffed-up, and he was losing weight. Respiratory problems started in the last few hours, after he'd been sick, and I believe the two are related.

I really, really hope this never happens again.

I hope it doesn't either, Teresa.

I hope the same Teresa.

Update on Sammy:

He's steadily gaining weight, gaining in confidence and even being a little spoiled brat at times! He's gaining adult shape and iridescence.
He's very curious, very cheeky, and really affectionate sometimes. He keeps trying to groom my hands!
But when I intrude in his cage, like to pick him up at feeding time, he pecks (sometimes even with his head upside-down) and does a little challenge-to-invaders call that's exactly like Hercules'. (If he's enrolled in the Hercules School of Charm, I'm in trouble!)

Just like Petra mentioned about hers, he can pick up seed, peas, etc, from my hand or from the dish, but when he tries to toss them back into the back of his mouth, they just fall off. By putting small seeds into a deep dish, he does manage to eat a few, but he's still being hand-fed twice a day.

Here's the little scoundrel:



He's standing upright about 40% of the time, and he often exercises his wings, but he's never flown -- not even a bit. However, he's obviously getting stronger, and I'm sure he'll keep on trying.

This is what he does when I let him run around on the floor:

https://s333.photobucket.com/albums/m381/Skbllz/Pigeons/Sammy/?action=view&current=DSCNB4297.flv

He looks very intelligent. It must be frustrating to go backward when you want to go forward.

Teresa wrote:

Update on Sammy:

He's steadily gaining weight, gaining in confidence and even being a little spoiled brat at times! He's gaining adult shape and iridescence.
He's very curious, very cheeky, and really affectionate sometimes. He keeps trying to groom my hands!
But when I intrude in his cage, like to pick him up at feeding time, he pecks (sometimes even with his head upside-down) and does a little challenge-to-invaders call that's exactly like Hercules'. (* If he's enrolled in the Hercules School of Charm, I'm in trouble!)

Just like Petra mentioned about hers, he can pick up seed, peas, etc, from my hand or from the dish, but when he tries to toss them back into the back of his mouth, they just fall off.

** By putting small seeds into a deep dish, he does manage to eat a few, but he's still being hand-fed twice a day.

*** He's standing upright about 40% of the time, and he often exercises his wings, but he's never flown -- not even a bit. However, he's obviously getting stronger, and I'm sure he'll keep on trying.

This is what he does when I let him run around on the floor:

https://s333.photobucket.com/albums/m381/Skbllz/Pigeons/Sammy/?action=view&current=DSCNB4297.flv

* :That\\\'s so f

** That's great, Teresa.

*** This is encouraging news.
They truly are incredible little ones.

More about Sammy:

He now weighs 300 g, practically the same as Hercules!!! But the seizures still continue unabated. During floor time today, at one point he overbalanced to the left (always that side!) and fell over, kicking his legs and flapping his wings, and totally panicking. I had to pick him up and cuddle him for ages before he stopped shaking.
Something I noticed, during that extreme seizure, his head and his feet felt very, very hot. I remember reading ages ago that there was only one pigeon disease that caused a rise in temperature, and I think it was meningitis. I'm going to try and find out more about that.

Latest rescue:

This is Rupert, my new rescue. I found him at the park two days ago, on a late night walk with my dog.
He can't fly, but the reason for that is not at all apparent. No visible injuries, reasonable poops, wings and legs work perfectly well, but when walking he sometimes wobbles a little. His appetite was poor at first, but it's getting better.
All I found was that he was very underweight (250 g then, 285 today) and the inside of his mouth looked greyish -- but it doesn't now.
I'm handfeeding him once a day and giving him a probiotic, and making sure he's always got plenty of food and water. Today he had a little garlic too, as the next step will be worming, but the order hasn't arrived yet.

OH my goodness... sending healing thoughts straight your way! Bless your wonderful heart.

You tell that Hercules.. that I need him, so he has got to gain his weightback What a continuing story your house is. I love reading this thread, not only because I have learned so much, but the love that resides on this thread, makes me SMILE!

Hi Teresa,
Rupert's off balance might be caused from lack of eating, for whatever reason.

Is he able to take what you are feeding him without any problems?

Sending special get well wishes Rupert's way.
Bless you both.

Keep us posted.

Fancyfeathers wrote:

Hi Teresa,
Rupert's off balance might be caused from lack of eating, for whatever reason.

Is he able to take what you are feeding him without any problems?

Sending special get well wishes Rupert's way.
Bless you both.

Keep us posted.

Now that you mention it... I wonder if he is reallllllly dehydrated????

AZJourney wrote:

Fancyfeathers wrote:

Hi Teresa,
Rupert's off balance might be caused from lack of eating, for whatever reason.

Is he able to take what you are feeding him without any problems?

Sending special get well wishes Rupert's way.
Bless you both.

Keep us posted.

Now that you mention it... I wonder if he is reallllllly dehydrated????

Jenn. I should have mentioned that as well.
Dehydration, especially severe dehydration, can certainly cause a pigeon to become off balance. Generally if a pigeon is falling face forward specifically indicates severe dehydration.

Good point Jenn and Cindy. Could be.