Pigeon Angels
Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

Pigeon Angels


 
RegisterSearchHomeLog in
At this time Pigeon Angels forum is in an archive status. For assistance please log into Pigeon Angels Facebook by clicking the following link. Thank You https://www.facebook.com/groups/176239232007/?hc_location=stream

 

 HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!

Go down 
+3
priya
Matilda
NiteOwl
7 posters
AuthorMessage
NiteOwl
Special Pigeon Angel
NiteOwl

Posts : 2194
Join date : 2009-01-19
Location : Southern New England

HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Empty
PostSubject: HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!   HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Icon_minitimeSun Jun 13, 2010 8:56 am

And if you go to this page, there are lots of other links to follow with amazing information. Just unbelievable what goes on!


What happens to Steve Souza's pigeons,
in his own words, which is only a sample of such messages posted to
various email discussion list(s) and newsgroups:

To read about more abuses, click on Death to Lost and Found Racing/Fancy Pigeons,
Killing Pigeons for Ego, Profit, and Fun and Competitive Pigeon Racers'/Fanciers' Attitudes

Note: It is a customary practice of competitive pigeon racers like Souza to kill lost birds they retrieve after being found and reported by concerned people. The hapless bird may be the result of "basket culling" in the first place, which means that birds are carelessly released far from home and any who don't make it back to their family and friends (in essence, abandoned) are deemed not worthy of keeping, anyway.

A tactic to build and maintain a false public image by the competitive pigeon racing community is to assure finders that lost birds are welcome back home, even though they will actually be killed -- if not immediately, most likely in the very near future because their failure to return home proved to their owner that they are no longer worthy of being alive. With pigeons, we cull/kill the ones that do not fall within the intended genetic guidelines. ... If there is a bird that cannot race home in record time, or performs with less ability than the rest of the team, we can cull/kill him as well.

With humans it is less cut-and-dry... if we find one who does not perform as desired, we usually simply put up with him. If he is found to be genetically lacking, to the point of being destructive within the rest of the group, we cull/kill him as well. ...

As for me, I'll stick to seeking a higher standard. I will continue to cull/kill those that I can that are outside of the desired goal. If one seems to be within acceptable limits, I will watch closely to see if he really is worth keeping, or if instead, he should be terminated for the good of the species.

God put on this earth for us, WE are the dominant species, and we are not to be subject to the other, lesser animals ...to maintain ...a static 100 birds... 100% of the rest, or about 90% of what is bred, will either die, or be eliminated. If they don't die due to health problems, or from race hazards (wire strikes, hunters, hawks, bad weather, radio waves, or actually getting lost), then they will have to be culled in the loft.

If we sent the race horse into the same conditions (drove it to point A, and said, "I'll see you at home, good luck", and it had ... to find it's own way home across country... we'd see the same kind of loses with horses.

... some birds are genetically inferior (or just stupid), and just don't manage to complete their training (they get lost, they follow some other bird home instead, or they decide to land in the back yard of a cat owner...).

again... Please don't confuse those who breed and race / show pigeons with the "pet owners" who have a few because they love them as family members. Just as doctors and cops cannot do their job effectively if they get emotionally attached to those they work with... neither can animal breeders and sportsmen.

We do not ... get too sentimental when it comes to putting a priority on the betterment of the species.

And actually, both personally and professionally, I am completely anal, I have to be, or the attention to detail would slip right through the cracks.

...We all are entitled to know who and what we are dealing with. If we have radical elements here, who go 'postal' at the mention of selective culling, we all have the right to know, rather than have there be a closet animal rightist in our midst.

http://urbanwildlifesociety.org/pigeons/fancy/SouzaPijAbuses.html
Back to top Go down
Matilda
Special Pigeon Angel
Matilda

Posts : 9198
Join date : 2009-01-11
Location : Pacific Northwest of the United States of America

HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Empty
PostSubject: Re: HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!   HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Icon_minitimeSun Jun 13, 2010 9:18 am

Great find, Jay.
I know many people that race pigeons will swear up and down that they don't cull birds or know f anyone that does. The same people have hateful things to say about any advocacy group or person that condemns this part of the the pigeon sport as cruel and unnecessary.
I suspect those saying the hateful things...those yelling the loudest...could be the ones that cull the most.
Just for our reference here and if we should need it handy in the future, I'm going to turn it into a sticky.

I also want to make note, that there are some people that race pigeons that don't kill their birds.
Back to top Go down
NiteOwl
Special Pigeon Angel
NiteOwl

Posts : 2194
Join date : 2009-01-19
Location : Southern New England

HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Empty
PostSubject: Re: HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!   HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Icon_minitimeSun Jun 13, 2010 9:24 am

It's terrible. They are treated like inanimate objects. I think it sad and horrifying that people with no heart at all for another of Gods creatures, can own any animal. And if you are wondering how they do it,

_________
From: Harry Hill [Maverick Loft]
. . .
... I cull pigeons that are physically inferior...I cull more birds than I give away because they won't make good racers or breeders for anyone else and ...to feed it for no other reason than its here is wasteful when the feed could be put to better uses.
Ron Huntley wrote:

...how would you kill a pigeon... We have seen here that the methods described range from feeding rat poison, drowning, gassing, popping them in the head, cutting their heads off, pulling their heads off and last but not least bearing [sic] them alive.
From: Harry Hill [Maverick Loft]
. . .
I got a message yesterday ... [about] a call from a lady with a lost bird...

. . .
...what I want to avoid is having a situation where the legal owner contacts the animal lover and says to kill it or picks it up and kills it. That happens...often. ...we do have to be discreet...
http://urbanwildlifesociety.org/pigeons/fancy/FncyPijKilling.html
Back to top Go down
Matilda
Special Pigeon Angel
Matilda

Posts : 9198
Join date : 2009-01-11
Location : Pacific Northwest of the United States of America

HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Empty
PostSubject: Re: HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!   HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Icon_minitimeSun Jun 13, 2010 9:38 am

I can't wrap my mind around the why....I just can't. There doesn't seem to be a darn

thing any of us

can do to stop it either, except be aware ourselves and let others know. ...educate without

alienating is a key. That...and hope that karma catches up with them and ends their cruel

actions.
Back to top Go down
NiteOwl
Special Pigeon Angel
NiteOwl

Posts : 2194
Join date : 2009-01-19
Location : Southern New England

HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Empty
PostSubject: Re: HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!   HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Icon_minitimeSun Jun 13, 2010 9:46 am

Well it isn't really hard to understand WHY. First you have to understand that these are people with no heart and no conscience. Then you have to understand that all they care about is winning. And maybe MONEY. These are people who have no respect for life, or for much of anything. Everything is expendable to them. They just care about the bottom line, and the results. The problem is, that there are far too many of these kind of people in the world. They are like serial killers, only instead of people, they kill birds. Poor defenseless little birds, who didn't ask to be brought into this world to begin with. And now they're tortured and killed at no fault of their own.

The amazing thing is that anyone could actually just do this to an animal. But then, you would have to go back to understanding where these bottom dwellers are coming from.
Back to top Go down
Matilda
Special Pigeon Angel
Matilda

Posts : 9198
Join date : 2009-01-11
Location : Pacific Northwest of the United States of America

HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Empty
PostSubject: Re: HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!   HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Icon_minitimeSun Jun 13, 2010 10:10 am

NiteOwl wrote:
Well it isn't really hard to understand WHY. First you have to understand that these are people with no heart and no conscience. Then you have to understand that all they care about is winning. And maybe MONEY. These are people who have no respect for life, or for much of anything. Everything is expendable to them. They just care about the bottom line, and the results. The problem is, that there are far too many of these kind of people in the world. They are like serial killers, only instead of people, they kill birds. Poor defenseless little birds, who didn't ask to be brought into this world to begin with. And now they're tortured and killed at no fault of their own.

The amazing thing is that anyone could actually just do this to an animal. But then, you would have to go back to understanding where these bottom dwellers are coming from.

Intellectually I undertand... I read the words and I know what they mean. I know self centered people motivated by profit or power. Still...emotionally I can't wrap my mind around hurting something for personal gain.
Back to top Go down
priya
Special Pigeon Angel
priya

Posts : 662
Join date : 2009-10-25
Location : Bangalore, India

HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Empty
PostSubject: Re: HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!   HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Icon_minitimeSun Jun 13, 2010 10:16 am

Seeing red/mad Seeing red/mad Seeing red/mad Seeing red/mad
Back to top Go down
NiteOwl
Special Pigeon Angel
NiteOwl

Posts : 2194
Join date : 2009-01-19
Location : Southern New England

HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Empty
PostSubject: Re: HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!   HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Icon_minitimeSun Jun 13, 2010 12:20 pm

Matilda wrote:
NiteOwl wrote:
Well it isn't really hard to understand WHY. First you have to understand that these are people with no heart and no conscience. Then you have to understand that all they care about is winning. And maybe MONEY. These are people who have no respect for life, or for much of anything. Everything is expendable to them. They just care about the bottom line, and the results. The problem is, that there are far too many of these kind of people in the world. They are like serial killers, only instead of people, they kill birds. Poor defenseless little birds, who didn't ask to be brought into this world to begin with. And now they're tortured and killed at no fault of their own.

The amazing thing is that anyone could actually just do this to an animal. But then, you would have to go back to understanding where these bottom dwellers are coming from.

Intellectually I undertand... I read the words and I know what they mean. I know self centered people motivated by profit or power. Still...emotionally I can't wrap my mind around hurting something for personal gain.

That is because you and I and thank God, many others respect life, and do not look at a thinking feeling creature as an inanimate object. I know, it's hard to imagine that a HUMAN BEING could think like that, with no caring at all for the pain and suffering of another life. I have no idea at all, of what could possibly make another person so hard and callous.
To take a poor bird, shove him in a crate, bring him hundreds of miles away from his home and family, and everything familiar, and release him to try to find his way back home. He does the very best that he can, as he wants to get home, to what he perceives as safety. And in the end, even if he does make it through heat and storms, and hawks and other dangers, and thirst and hunger, if he in fact does not do this fast enough for the owners liking, he is killed. So the whole time that he is fighting to return to his "safety", in reality, he is returning to his death. I would like to take all the people who do this, and put them on an island hundreds of miles from civilization, and tell them to SWIM. And if they don't make it back fast enough, line them up and shoot them.
Back to top Go down
Jackie\'s Mom
Special Pigeon Angel
Jackie\'s Mom

Posts : 797
Join date : 2009-03-31
Age : 74
Location : LasVegas, Nevada

HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Empty
PostSubject: Re: HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!   HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Icon_minitimeSun Jun 13, 2010 12:27 pm

Thank you for posting this........however, reading this make me so upset. Seeing red/mad Very sad Very sad Seeing red/mad

I believe in pigeon 1 karma/devine justice. HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! 35455 .........you just need patience.......it takes time, but sooner or later these heartless creeps will get theirs.


Louise
Back to top Go down
NiteOwl
Special Pigeon Angel
NiteOwl

Posts : 2194
Join date : 2009-01-19
Location : Southern New England

HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Empty
PostSubject: Re: HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!   HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Icon_minitimeSun Jun 13, 2010 12:45 pm

Jackie's Mom wrote:
Thank you for posting this........however, reading this make me so upset. Seeing red/mad Very sad Very sad Seeing red/mad

I believe in pigeon 1 karma/devine justice. HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! 35455 .........you just need patience.......it takes time, but sooner or later these heartless creeps will get theirs.


Louise

Louise, I'm sorry. I didn't mean to upset you. It's just that it makes me so angry and frustrated. And there are so many who claim that this doesn't go on, and that we pigeon advocates are crazy to think that there is any cruelty in the "sport" of pigeon racing. I just wanted to show everyone what these same people say and what they think about the birds that they claim to care about. I know that there are people who don't do these kinds of things with their birds, but if they don't, then what do they do with them?
Back to top Go down
Teresa
Administrative Member
Teresa

Posts : 5381
Join date : 2009-07-23
Location : Portugal

HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Empty
PostSubject: Re: HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!   HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Icon_minitimeSun Jun 13, 2010 5:42 pm

Very upsetting! Unfortunately it seems that most of the people who are very competitive about winning races, do these despicable deeds a lot -- and then they mock those people who don't! Seeing red/mad

The true face of PigeonRacingPigeons:

  • 2010 January « Pigeon Racing Pigeons
    (Moxidectin, Moxidectin Plus, and Eqvalan are very good ones. ...... year quickly cull all of those individuals who do not secure two or more good prizes. ...
    pigeonracingpigeons.com/2010/01/ - Cached


(The article above, which I found profoundly upsetting, can no longer be seen on the site, but the Google headline shows the gist of the writing. I'd stumbled upon it when searching for possible suppliers of Moxidectin Plus.)

  • OTHER MISTAKE

    It is important to learn from your mistakes. In the past it happened to me that I let a baby live which was not in good health. The only reason was that it was off of special parents. It never ever happened that such a bird became any good. Now I have no mercy on them any more. Good health is the main thing required from a bird at any age. If a baby is not in good health first eliminate it and only then look at the band to see what the parents were. If you first look off of which parents it was bred you are prejudiced and judge with different eyes and you may be persuaded to let it live.

    (The Secret of the Champions by: Ad Schaerlaeckens)



  • May 30, 2010 PigeonRacingFan Leave a comment
    Secret #7: I Believe in Heredity
    ...
    In both the racing and breeding lofts, the true value of a pigeon will be found only by actual tests, either by flying or by the quality of young it produces. The true tests of a quality breeder are the performance and breeding success of its offspring, not its own race record. If a bird cannot reproduce itself or better, it is no good as a breeder and should be culled. Remember results will not be seen in one year. It will take 2 years to see any real evidence.

    (Secret #7: I Believe in Heredity, By Bob Prisco)



  • May 26, 2010 PigeonRacingFan 2 comments
    My Best Kept “Secrets”

    It is easy to understand the enthusiasm a fancier displays at the start of a new season. Last season’s failures will soon be forgotten with this year’s great accomplishments and results. However, to expect a great turn around is foolish unless the specific problems from past years have been corrected. Basically, the pigeon fancier is a sentimentalist. Unfortunately, this is a serious problem in many lofts. Each year the fancier becomes attached to a few select birds. This attachment is due to a fancy pedigree, cost, strain, eyes, build, color, etc. After a few seasons of disappointing races, he does not or will not admit that some or all of these birds will never develop into anything but culls. He keeps the birds, hoping they will improve. He does not realize the harm that he is causing his loft.

    Over the next few days I will be going over with you some of my best kept “secrets” if you will. These main foundation blocks are part of the reason I have been so successful in this sport.

    (My Best Kept “Secrets”, By Bob Prisco)


Seeing red/mad Seeing red/mad Seeing red/mad
Back to top Go down
Matilda
Special Pigeon Angel
Matilda

Posts : 9198
Join date : 2009-01-11
Location : Pacific Northwest of the United States of America

HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Empty
PostSubject: Re: HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!   HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Icon_minitimeSun Jun 13, 2010 5:50 pm

I'm so glad we have this information.
Back to top Go down
AZWhitefeather
Owner/Administrator
AZWhitefeather

Posts : 10863
Join date : 2009-01-11
Location : Arizona Southwestern United States

HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Empty
PostSubject: Re: HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!   HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Icon_minitimeSun Jun 13, 2010 10:37 pm

I can't think of any one of us not being upset over this, however it is good to have this information and I thank you for finding and posting it, Jay. HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! 142829

Sadly, it's pretty much a given that some of these birds are going to be killed.
There are those who breed just to try and get the perfect bird, whether it be the fastest, the most unique coloring, the best pattern, etc. And how many times do they NOT get what they were hoping for. Heavens knows they don't have the room to house all these poor birds that were such a 'disappointment' to them.

It all just makes me sick to the core.

_________________
Cindy

A Pigeon's Prayer
Please watch over us while we fly,
Keeping us safe from the predators that share the sky.

If we become ill or injured in any way,
Please lead us to safety where we are welcome to stay.
Back to top Go down
http://www.pigeonangels.com
EgypSwiftLady
Special Pigeon Angel
EgypSwiftLady

Posts : 1526
Join date : 2009-10-23
Location : Wisconsin

HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Empty
PostSubject: Re: HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!   HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Icon_minitimeMon Jun 14, 2010 8:19 am

Unfortunately this pratice happens not only to pigeons but just about ANY animal that is bred for any particular sport. Very sad Very sad
Back to top Go down
http://www.ironwolffarmsanctuary.com
NiteOwl
Special Pigeon Angel
NiteOwl

Posts : 2194
Join date : 2009-01-19
Location : Southern New England

HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Empty
PostSubject: Re: HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!   HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Icon_minitimeMon Jun 14, 2010 2:25 pm

You're right Robin. Good point. I'm sure there are many animals out there that are discarded the same way. Crazy isn't it?
Back to top Go down
AZWhitefeather
Owner/Administrator
AZWhitefeather

Posts : 10863
Join date : 2009-01-11
Location : Arizona Southwestern United States

HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Empty
PostSubject: Re: HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!   HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Icon_minitimeMon Jun 14, 2010 5:21 pm

NiteOwl wrote:
You're right Robin. Good point.
I'm sure there are many animals out there that are discarded the same way. Crazy isn't it?

:Yes:

_________________
Cindy

A Pigeon's Prayer
Please watch over us while we fly,
Keeping us safe from the predators that share the sky.

If we become ill or injured in any way,
Please lead us to safety where we are welcome to stay.
Back to top Go down
http://www.pigeonangels.com
Sponsored content




HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Empty
PostSubject: Re: HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!   HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND! Icon_minitime

Back to top Go down
 
HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT WHAT I JUST FOUND!
Back to top 
Page 1 of 1

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
Pigeon Angels :: Pigeons and Their Friends :: Animal Advocacy-
Jump to: